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Last Call #8

Off Topic: Last Call #8

The AH Crew sit down to talk about The Killing Joke, Mark Hamill, Batman comics and more on this week's Off Topic!

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Comments (74)

  • RTLstuff FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Normal Meat Person

    10 months ago

    I just started watching The Killing Joke and the romance angle feels so frickin weird and so very unnecessary for the story. Not everything needs a romance angle!

  • oldmythologies FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I was the only person in my group that thought The Killing Joke was a flaming heap of garbage and it's always so validating when someone agrees with me. Thanks Jon.

  • UltraZero FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold OmniGeek

    10 months ago

    The "daddy daughter" vibe was a recent idea. Around the time the Killing Joke occured, Batman was written as being around 28 and Barbara was in college.

  • silverswords FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I'd be curious to hear more of what Jon has to say on the movie. I actually liked it. I agree with Michael that they put no effort to reconcile the two halves and it was basically like two movies, but for the most part neither of them bothered me. Little problems here and there but overall I enjoyed it.

  • The_Nik_of_Time FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Just in Time

    10 months ago

  • Garbagci FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold a bad joke with legs

    10 months ago

    I'm Jon during movies

  • GamingLeopardCat FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Sammich Queen

    10 months ago

    Ryan: *knocks over can*

    Micheal: Be respectful

    Ryan: *steps on can*

    Micheal: OH COME ON *angry*

    Trevor: *picks up can*

    Micheal: Thanks Trevor *calm again*


    like wow XD

  • Kaotix FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    Is the camera lens cracked at the bottom center of Michael's camera shot, or this that something else?

    Nevermind, that's just his pint glass creeping into the shot.

  • burntheghosts FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I enjoyed The Killing Joke as like. Something that was funny. I made some jokes during about the bad animation and stuff, but I had a good time just laughing at it and enjoying the voice acting. I didn't really go in expecting it to be fantastic, though, so I had a good time. I can see where someone that was in it for more than the voice acting might not. The Batgirl backstory was definitely atrocious - and the overly stereotypical gay best friend was really killing me, too, I'm glad they talked about that.

  • theory88 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold dsco

    10 months ago

    Ryan... please stop knocking over fucking diet coke cans :( JUST STOP!!

  • DavidtheWavid FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    Honestly I loved The Killing Joke. Spoilers.


    An explosion that shows a severed hand. A sex scene. That shit was dark. But maybe I just love any animated Batman anything.


    By no means would I say it was flawless. But guys, at least watch it before you rip on it.

    • rogueleader3 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold I too, am Catbug

      10 months ago

      I think you do like anything with Batman that happens to be animated.

  • LNCUppercut FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    The two Dark Knight Returns animated movies are the best Batman movies ever made.

    • DavidtheWavid FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      Seriously. Watch The Killing Joke.

  • Dum8kid FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I honestly felt like Michael was describing my reactions when I saw The Killing Joke, you're not the only one @Jon you're not the only one. I should've taken a 40 minute shower instead of just sitting and fuming in my hatred.

  • TheXPR3 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I didn't think it was that bad honestly. Future viewings will probably mean skipping the Batgirl stuff because it kinda is just a semi related episode. The performances were good, Hamill especially. Kinda wished they had used the time/effort from the first half to just help fully adapt and animate the actual story. I wanted to see KJ read by Hamill and Conroy, And its pretty much exactly what I got.

  • Ironlordthemad FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I hope the phrase "40 minute shower" becomes a thing...

  • audiotof FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold InvaderTOF

    10 months ago

    I had ordered The Killing Joke on Amazon; I hope the order cancellation go through.

    • DavidtheWavid FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      At least watch it before buying.

  • Baldur5 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    Sounds like The Killing Joke might be well suited for Theater Mode

    • DavidtheWavid FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      Yeah, because DC would sell the rights to one of their most hyped movies this decade to some drunk gamers (no pun intended) so they can rip on it.

  • AmadoMayday FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold The cream of the crop

    10 months ago

    It saddens me that The Killing Joke was bad. DC animated movies are usually good

    • JacobSB FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      it wasnt bad though even most people who hate it love how they did the actual comic part and the performances etc. Dont take the opinions here because they can be very opinated and not care about anything else. They just dont like the sex bit with batman and alluring to rape for joker. I already had the raped vibe from comic before and yes the sex scene is uncomfortable its supposed to be uncomfortable. It was a shocking controversial comic and they wanted to add to it. They hit excatly what they wanted.

    • PacMonster FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      @JacobSB ...they didn't have an issue with the Joker rape bit, at no point in this discussion do they discuss that being a problem. The comic heavily implies that's what happens when there's pictures of her naked body in the coaster ride.


      The criticism is that the additions did not address any of the Killing Joke comic's faults and simply traded one cliche for several more. The solution to building up Bat Girl's character to give the scene more emotional weight when she gets shot by the Joker was not to just have Bat Girl and Batman awkwardly fuck. And the problem isn't even so much that they had sex, it's that there was no believable leadup to it and what leadup there was made that moment even more wrong. Batman spends what little involvement he has in the first half hour acting like Barbara's dad, telling her what boys she shouldn't deal with. At no point does the movie infer Batman has any sort of romantic feelings toward Barbara and when she has feelings for Batman it just comes off like a major father complex.


      And that's just the new material which Michael starts off by saying, their complaints aren't just about that. The "R" rating was wasted since there's really nothing in the movie that properly warrants it. The animation quality is based off a poor decision from DC animation to directly copy the style of the panels from the comic without any sort of blending or uniformity to the rest of the animation. The result is they get the iconic moments but shitty transitions in between.


      I personally didn't hate the movie like John did, though I agree with the criticisms.

    • DavidtheWavid FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      I always shipped Barbara and Bruce. It seemed natural to me, but I grew up on The Batman, not The Animated Series, so maybe that had something a little more subliminal...?


      Anyway, there was a severed hand when the yacht blew up. That was probably where most of the R rating came from.

    • JacobSB FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      @PacMonster i wasnt just referring to Micheal when i said most people. I've seen the hatred on it and that was one of them so i added that in. My point was it was the terrible disaster they make it out to be here. Should the scenes been handled better sure they were trying to touch on a mentor intimacy that came off controversial. Despite that the actual killing joke part was fantastic and even people who hate on the added scenes have said that. That was my point here.

  • ArcticCascade FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Silence

    10 months ago

    This explains a lot. I've not read the comic, and thought the film was odd to say the least.

  • datsfantastic FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    Admittedly after my friend and I saw the tweets, we hoped this would be discussed on Off Topic in some way. Glad we weren't disappointed.

  • SwedishGayRobot Thomas

    10 months ago

    "John: That's not canon"

    I mean, there are so many different telnings in comic books that I wanna bring up the question:
    What is even canon?

    Yes I know what canon is but like, it's just a Batman story told by some people.

    You can tell a different story with the same and/or similar characters.



    • PacMonster FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      To John's statement, he's technically not being accurate. The Killing Joke was an "in canon" story. The origin of the joker that was expanded on in the Killing Joke was actually an existing origin from much older Detective Comics storylines (the whole red hood falling into a vat of chemicals, thus bleaching his skin, and driving him insane, was not introduced in Killing Joke. Making him a sympathetic character with a backstory is what was added). The parts that have been "retconned" were just the specifics of his backstory before falling into the vat of chemicals and even within the Killing Joke the Joker alludes to this basically undoing the previously told story by suggesting that he remembers it one way and sometimes another and that he prefers his backstory to be "multiple choice". They were going for the whole unreliable narrator thing.


      To answer your question however, the "canon" is generally what DC publishes as a part of its main continuity. Things that aren't in canon will usually be labeled as such and usually are else world stories, one off stories, or any comic that drastically messes with the established formula of the characters.

    • DavidtheWavid FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      The way I see it, this just brings the comic into the Animated Series/Arkham canon.

  • biginer48 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    i liked the movie

  • Wiseposterior FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    "If you're a fan you'll love it."


    I had the same thing happen with Lazer Team. So many people said, "If you are a fan of Rooster Teeth, you will love it." Being a Rooster Teeth fan I went in expecting to enjoy it. It was one of the worst movies I've ever seen.

    • RDV-1996 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold RDV

      10 months ago

      You haven't seen any bad movies then. it was definitely better than Pixels. It wasn't a bad movie, Not a good movie either. But it was enjoyable.

  • Calebb97 God of Destruction

    10 months ago

    I liked it :

  • MaximWilliamson FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I feel everyone is entitled to an opinion, but I just don't see how it was horrible. I mean it wasn't amazing, great, or good by any means. Maybe it's because I watched it after I watched this so I went in to it expecting to hate it, but it wasn't as bad as they say it is, I just don't understan

  • SolisD FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Wet Dreamer

    10 months ago

    don't they fuck in the batman beyond story line.

    • Matsteven FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      They did, and while Barb is alot older than, people still hated it.

    • micael1495 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Michael

      10 months ago

      When? In the show or in the comic?

  • juansanroman FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I saw the movie, and the Mark Hamill bit was at the beginning too.


    P.S.: I knew about the Batman & Batgirl relationship, and I was expecting something like that in the movie. I'm a grown man, I grew up watching that Batman Animated Series, I love comic books, but seeing them finally go at it made me unbelievably uncomfortable.

  • MasterfulOop FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Mr and Mrs. Jones' Child

    10 months ago

    Is there any reason why they're all standing and looking like they're ready and eager to leave on Last Call?

    • DanDanGames FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      thats how bars work

  • tahupierce FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    Man, Michael cannot be stopped. There are days when he talks for at least hour on a livestream, then on a couple of high energy let's plays, then records lines for any one of the animated shows he's on, then steamrolls through this podcast which including the post show can easily run three hours. Seven or more hours PER DAY of continuous dialogue, and by God he'll yell and cackle and hijack the conversation until the last minute of it. Burnie is right to be amazed. When Ray left RT lost some content, if Michael leaves it'll just be empty.

  • TodayAmazing FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    Yay Jon!

  • OnlyAverage FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    You guys should do Killing Joke for Theater Mode

    • DavidtheWavid FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      Yeah, DC's gonna sell the rights to one of the most, if not the most hyped animated movies of the year so drunk gamers can rip on it.

    • OnlyAverage FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      I doubt it would be possible any time in the future, but it would be entertaining as fuck. Especially if they had some of the bigger comic book fans in the company on for it.

  • PUREChron FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    "The AH Crew STAND* to talk about The Killing Joke, Mark Hamill, Batman comics and more on this week's Off Topic!"

  • MrSteelCrayon FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    Can we please have a segment or show where Michael reviews films

    • Wiseposterior FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      Theater Mode is kind of like a feature length review.

  • kellibean123 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    a frustrated Jon Risinger is easily one of the funniest things in the world. and for that reason, and that reason only, On the Spot will never die

  • majingin

    10 months ago

    Barbara got raped that was pretty rated R

    • SolisD FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Wet Dreamer

      10 months ago

      On screen?

    • pwners4u FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      she wasnt raped, the joker took pictures of her naked to force her dad to see

  • BradTackett FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Brad

    10 months ago

    Man, I must be the ONLY person who liked it. I enjoyed it. I skipped a little of the Batgirl stuff, but I mean I liked watching it.

  • AgentLin FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Shadow

    10 months ago

    I cannot believe I actually saw that movie, like who the hell let these people make the killing joke, the ending was even ridiculous, but the ending of this was funny, Ryan gosh!

    • TheXPR3 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      Isn't the ending the exact same as the graphic novel tho? Minus some of the ambiguity anyway.

  • forest1wolf FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    John don't read the comments.

  • pwners4u FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    i watched it and didnt mind it, i liked the killing joke part and the joker's history is one of his origins and it is canon in the red hood story line as that is why jason todd wears the red hood costume. If they added nightwing and made it so batgirl and nightwing are a couple it probably would have been better or have no romantic relations at all but the killing joke part wasnt that bad i like it more than the damian wayne movies but not as much as under the red hood which is batman's best animated movie and flashpoint paradox being the best justice league one

  • WhiteGrizzly FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I love Trevor, wish he was in a little more content

    • LizzieGrl42 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold LizzieGrl42

      10 months ago

      He's a great addition in Dead By Daylight

  • Charlie2094 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I didn't mind the Killing Joke part so much, but the added 20 minutes of Batgirl was the worst, some of the worst writing they've ever had in one of their animated films, she was just sex obsessed (almost every line with her was about it, a boyfriend or whatever), her gay coworker, pining over Batman, and then the whole father/daughter like scene was just wrong on so many levels. Had the complete opposite affect of what they were trying to do, destroyed her character rather than make us care more.


    The rest of the film wasn't so bad, once they really got into the main Killing Joke story but yeah wasn't good. Animation wasn't great, but should've been better, no reason for "R" either. Feel kinda sorry for Hamill and Conroy, should've been like their swan song. It's disappointing.

  • hunter559 FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    In the Bruce Tim universe, the Batman the animated series verse, batman and batgirl hooked up

    • pwners4u FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      yeah but i prefer her and nightwing as they are the same age and then you have batman and talia

  • 123soifon FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    I think the part about Batgirl and Batman relationship was meant to tie in with their relationship in Batman Beyond series.

    • PatrickRyanW

      10 months ago

      but batman beyond has nothing to do with killing joke.

    • majingin

      10 months ago

      It's in the Bruce Tim Batman Universe though

  • hitpiggy FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Ehh fuck it

    10 months ago

    You're hating on it way too much. Was it great? No. Was it good? At some parts. But it wasn't awful at all. The batgirl extra storyline could've been made so much better but they fucked it up. I wish they would have maybe extended that soryline into a movie. It could've been interesting. The rest is pretty faithful to the comic but I noticed at some points it was very choppy and hard to watch but some parts smooth as butter. Really weird. Anyway I just thought you bashed on it too hard.

    • PatrickRyanW

      10 months ago

      no it was garbage, if you want to add something extra to a story then fine but atleast make it relevant the batgirl part on the first half wasn't needed and it's something none of us asked for.

    • hitpiggy FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold Ehh fuck it

      10 months ago

      hey patrick! Did I fucking say that the extra shite was good? no. I said it COULD have been good. But the whole movie wasn't god awful

  • bingomassacre FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

    10 months ago

    Why is this in the main feed if it isn't out yet? It says nothing about being unwatchable on the main AH page. Not a fan of this randomness on any of the RT websites at the moment.

    • SeanTFlynn FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold RT Activist

      10 months ago

      I'm pretty sure it means that they have added it to the site so that when the time rolls around they just touch a button to make it available. If they tried to upload it at it's release time and something goes wrong you'd have even more people bitching.

    • bingomassacre FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold

      10 months ago

      @SeanTFlynn - yes, they do this - but it doesn't go to the main page until it's actually released.

    • SeanTFlynn FIRST Member Star(s) Indication of membership status - One star is a FIRST member, two stars is Double Gold RT Activist

      10 months ago

      @bingomassacre - Just do what I do and go to recently added. It only shows videos that are released.